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8E clutch spring tightening

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8E clutch spring tightening

Post  falcone on Sat Oct 05, 2013 8:40 pm

Hi all, I have a couple of questions regarding the clutch on my 8E. I have replaced the corks with new ones from villiers services. These are much thicker than the old ones - do I need to reduce their thickness? I have ordered a copy of J.H. Goddard's book, but until it arrives I am in the dark. If I don't reduce their thickness, the clutch adjusting screw runs out of travel.
Secondly, I have replaced the springs - the old ones had the screws tightened fully against the pillars. Is this correct, or does one only tighten them enough to prevent clutch slip?
Thanks
Marcus

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clutch

Post  piston 197 on Sun Oct 06, 2013 4:14 am

Normal practice is to tighten screws fully home, if Villiers services have provided the correct corks you should be o.k , obviously you will need to adjust the rod adjustment, or if the rods are too short add a ball bearing between them.
JH
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Re: 8E clutch spring tightening

Post  Jack Clegg on Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:05 am

Or get a longer rod.
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fitting a bll bearing

Post  piston 197 on Sun Oct 06, 2013 11:06 am

I have always fitted a ball bearing in all clutch push rods , even if it means shortening rods to accommodate it.
The thinking is when the clutch is actuated flat surfaces are spinning against each other in full face contact, basically trying to butt weld themselves together and wearing at both ends of actuation.
The ball bearings smooth rounded surface will naturally transmit less friction and drive to the whole assembly, less burring of rod ends and less wear to the ends that are pushing at either end of the assembly.
or again you could as suggested above, just put a longer rod in it, but you will need to get some silver steel of the right length, or cut to length, then harden and temper both ends, as it is, not just a bit of soft steel, but I think finding a ball bearing that fits between the rods may be an easier option and a better engineering solution ??
JH
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Re: 8E clutch spring tightening

Post  Jack Clegg on Sun Oct 06, 2013 11:46 am

Do they not have different size rods for the 3 speed? 4 speed parts book lists a few lengths.
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clutch pushrods

Post  falcone on Sun Oct 06, 2013 7:26 pm

Thanks for the advice - I will try fitting a ball to see if that will bring the pushrod to a useable length. I read an article by Don Morley about rebuilding an Albion 4 speed gearbox as fitted to an Enfield 350, and he recommended cutting the pushrod in half, squaring off and polishing the cut ends and then hardening them. A ball is then inserted between them ( they would need to be adjusted for length). The reason for doing this is that the long pushrod tends to whip under load and rub against the rotating mainshaft, giving a heavier action.
I wonder if the same applies to the 3 speed box, and if anyone has tried it?

Marcus

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push rods

Post  piston 197 on Sun Oct 06, 2013 7:37 pm

As far as I know the Enfield uses one rod so when bearing against the spinning clutch the other end is spinning and wearing against the actuator. The rod would be hardened at each end , but soft in the middle, hence the need to harden the ends after cutting. The Villiers using separate pieces of rod should already be hardened at each end of each rod, so all you will have to do is insert a ball bearing of a size that will easily fit into the main shaft.
I don't, understand why the 3 speed or 4 speed would offer different lengths of rod as suggested in a post previously as each has a means of adjusting for differences, the 4 speed with a screw and lock nut, and the 3 speed has a threaded collar and the acorn external nut ??
Looks like Don Morley and I were both singing the merits of the ball bearing/push rod combination, and whereas I may not always know what I am on about, Don Morley was well respected and knew what he was on about !
JH
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clutch pushrods

Post  falcone on Sun Oct 06, 2013 7:48 pm

piston 197 wrote:As far as I know the Enfield uses one rod so when bearing against the spinning clutch the other end is spinning and wearing against the actuator. The rod would be hardened at each end , but soft in the middle, hence the need to harden the ends after cutting. The Villiers using separate pieces of rod should already be hardened at each end of each rod, so all you will have to do is insert a ball bearing of a size that will easily fit into the main shaft.
I don't, understand why the 3 speed or 4 speed would offer different lengths of rod as suggested in a post previously as each has a means of adjusting for differences, the 4 speed with a screw and lock nut, and the 3 speed has a threaded collar and the acorn  external nut ??
Looks like Don Morley and I  were both  singing the merits of the ball bearing/push rod combination, and whereas I may not always know what I am on about, Don Morley was well respected and knew what he was on about !
JH
I had wrongly assumed that the Villiers 3 speed only had one pushrod - looking at the parts diagram I can see my error in asking if anyone had tried splitting the pushrod and fitting a ball!
Many thanks for all the advice
Marcus

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Re: 8E clutch spring tightening

Post  Jack Clegg on Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:56 am

In me parts book for Falcon 67 page 33, it lists four different lengths of pushrod:-
7 5/8 - 7 1/2 - 7 9/16 & 7 23/32.
Not for the 3 speed though it seems.
I think VS corks are thicker than standard for the outer plate. Joe Goddard stated 1/16th of cork protruding from both faces of the outer plate. Less likely to slip with thicker corks I suppose, & if you can lengthen the rod with a ball bearing.
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Re: 8E clutch spring tightening

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